What are you doing for Earth Hour?

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What are you doing for Earth Hour?

Postby ashbergs » Mon Mar 23, 2009 12:26 pm

Earth Hour is just a few days away and I'm looking for ideas on how to spend my hour in the dark. Last year I ate dinner by candle light with a friend but this year I'm looking to do something a bit different perhaps with more people for bigger impact.

Any suggestions? How will you be spending your hour?
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Re: What are you doing for Earth Hour?

Postby jimshu » Wed Mar 25, 2009 7:49 pm

I'll be spending my hour with lights on, computer running , viewing videos and reading reports from the following sources.Trying to answer the ICCC Conference question-
The second International Conference on Climate Change concluded its 2-1/2 -day run March 10, 2009 in New York City after confronting the theme “Global warming: Was it ever really a crisis?”



http://icecap.us/
http://www.heartland.org/events/NewYork ... dings.html

http://www.realclimate.org/

That might burn up quite a bit of energy.
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Re: What are you doing for Earth Hour?

Postby earth2al » Wed Mar 25, 2009 7:51 pm

Thanks for the reminder! Since I have to work Sat night at 8:30, at an airport, I won't be able to personally observe but will subtly remind my wife and friends and turn off what I can. I like your "dinner by candlelite" idea since it doesn't add too much to our carbon footprint... Thanks again, Al :mrgreen:
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Re: What are you doing for Earth Hour?

Postby Zuleika » Thu Mar 26, 2009 7:51 pm

Never heard of it here in the UK
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Re: What are you doing for Earth Hour?

Postby jimshu » Thu Mar 26, 2009 9:49 pm

http://www.earthhour.org/files/MakingEa ... urTown.pdf

Do your bit to combat climate change!
But if you really are concerned with what's going on, and you do take the time to investigate that link, then take the time to read up at the links in my earlier post, and then see if we really can'combat' climate change.
Or should we put our efforts and money into solving more pressing problems on this planet- like feeding our growing millions, stopping deforestation, protecting wildlife, conserving water.........

Hey, there's real issues out there we can solve rather than pouring money and resources into trying to combat what are naturally driven changes.

You know, I am reading a book on the history of Scotland, written before all this climate change scaremongering comes along.
The author , in describing pre Norman invasion era, describes the climate in the Scottish Isles as warmer than today,and more inducive to agriculture.
So , compare that with today, as we are now told it's doom if the world gets any hotter....but hey, hang on a minute, the author was saying it was hotter then.
And civilisation flourished.And Vikings settled there, and Iceland, and Greenlandd and North America.Then along came the Little Ice Age that we have been recovering from.
And if it was hotter then, it follows that the scaremongering about Arctic Tundra melting and releasing massive amounts of Methane to fuel unstoppable global warming, should presumably have also have been a naturally occurring event way back then.
Oh, and I expect that the Arctic ice cap would also have been at a record minimum with those hotter temperatures of that period pre 1,000BC.

Roll on global warming and higher CO2 levels.Then I won't need to retire somewhere else for warmer climes!LOL
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Re: What are you doing for Earth Hour?

Postby DanielBMe » Fri Mar 27, 2009 8:58 am

Roll on global warming and higher CO2 levels.


Right and let's continue to pollute our air so that every single child on this planet ends up with Asthma. Ever see the air quality in Beijing? Personally I'd rather avoid that. While I agree there are more important issues, I would think that polluting the very air we breath is pretty darn unhealthy...for us, the ocean's, the wildlife. Seems to me, maybe we should be doing it all...

The more people on board for global warming the more likely they are to care about all the other issues. It's just the first step...

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Re: What are you doing for Earth Hour?

Postby ExplorerWannaBe » Fri Mar 27, 2009 9:22 am

DanielBMe wrote:Right and let's continue to pollute our air so that every single child on this planet ends up with Asthma. Ever see the air quality in Beijing? Personally I'd rather avoid that.


I would prefer to avoid the pollution in Beijing too but the dangerous and annoying pollution there is particulate matter, not CO2. It's much like the situation in Pittsburgh 30 years ago. Show me one real scientific study that shows a causal relationship between CO2 levels (which are changing so minutely we are detecting them today mainly due to the improvements in sensor technologies) and asthma.

DanielBMe wrote:While I agree there are more important issues, I would think that polluting the very air we breath is pretty darn unhealthy...for us, the ocean's, the wildlife. Seems to me, maybe we should be doing it all...


Here's the problem. CO2 is NOT a pollutant. Despite the wildest fantasies from Al Gore which appear to have been carried over by the Obama Administration and its current rendition of the EPA, CO2 is a natural substance and even the current and projected levels are clearly in line with naturally occurring historic levels. I think his point is that instead of wasting our energy, money and attention on a fraud, do something more productive and real.

DanielBMe wrote:The more people on board for global warming the more likely they are to care about all the other issues. It's just the first step...

JMHO


I disagree. First, I never subscribe to getting people on board with a fraud for any reason -- the ends do not justify the means. Second, I think the more people concentrate on this manmade issue of anthropogenic global warming and the claimed proximate cause of CO2 levels, the more they will feel they have done their part by subscribing to some phantom fix like "carbon neutrality" and ignore the REAL dangers.

Want to reduce your impact on the Earth? Concentrate on reducing waste. Period. Use a reuseable bottle with tap water and quit buying all the bottled water. Quit buying all the individually wrapped "convenience" servings of snacks, drinks, etc. Recycling is good but not even using plastic/aluminum/glass/etc. unnecessarily is even better.

Pick up trash when you see it. Anyone see the trash that was left behind at one of Al Gore's "enviro-activism" cattle calls prior to the US elections? Hell, the NRA conventions or NASCAR races were cleaner.

Sorry, I just don't subscribe to these feel-good-do-nothing shows of activity like "Earth Hour". Like so many politically-driven events, they are a lot of show and little-to-no substance.
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Re: What are you doing for Earth Hour?

Postby DanielBMe » Fri Mar 27, 2009 11:51 am

The numerical carbon-hydrogen ratio in gasoline is about 8:18. Carbon weighs 12 times as much as hydrogen, so the mass fraction is 8*12:18 or 96:18, in other words carbon is about 80% of the mass of gasoline. Each carbon atom combines with two oxygen atoms to form CO2, so the mass of CO2 going out the tail pipe is 0.8*44/12 = 2.9 times the mass of gasoline going in.

So, if you burn 1 gallon of gasoline, (3785 ml x 0.75 g/ml= 2.8 kg) you will get 2.9 kg CO2/kg fuel *2.8 kg fuel= 8.2 kg of CO2 out the tail pipe.

According to EarthSky Communications, Inc. a car in the U.S. on average puts out 7,700 Kg of Co2 (16,940lbs) a year.

Now if you expand that worldwide, please don't tell me it does not become a pollutant. There are many chemicals that are naturally occuring in say ....the water of streams. Magnify those chemicals a thousand fold can have dentrimental effects to the eco system, it has now become a pollutant...in my eyes. So yes, co2 occurs naturally in the environment, but by magnifying it a millionfold, I think it's safe to say it does indeed become a pollutant. I know what's it's like to be stuck in traffic and breathing in the emissions. It doesn't take a wiz to figure out the effect.

I think I can safely say that by polluting our air through co2 and the use of thousands of other chemicals, asthma as well as other respiratory diseases are certainly on the rise. It's just common sense. Is it solely co2? No. The point is we are polluting our air, not to mention our oceans.

I agree with most of what you and Jim say, just not entirely on global warming. I'd rather err on the side of caution rather than slapping my forehead a100 yrs from now exclaming "oops, shoulda known better".

Frankly I have no desire to debate global warming. I think it's a good cause and it is a good start to conversation of all the other items you mentioned. You would prefer the conversation to start elsewhere, that's fine. To me everybody has to start somewhere, some at the bottom of the ladder and some jump right up to the middle rung. It's all good.
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Re: What are you doing for Earth Hour?

Postby jimshu » Fri Mar 27, 2009 5:14 pm

Yehaw.Some thinking people out there.!
Great.
As you say Daniel, this forum is not the place for such a debate, because we're never going to solve it.
But it is a place to discuss ideas.And my purpose has been to encourage everyone to do a little research for themselves and start thinking for themselves and not follow the sheep.
Most people I know if global warming is mentioned, have only ever read headlines, or listened to news reports.
None have ever bothered to go research on the web.
I got into a debate on this subject 12 months ago , because of Earthhour being discussed, and got hammered by everyone because their belief in global warming was absolute.
But until I needled them, none had actually researched the facts.So it then boiled down to everyone using google to justify their positions, because no one would accept the others view.
Since then I went in search of facts and reports on the whole subject.
And I find we just don't know enough.As we come up with one theory ,other ongoing research throws a new spin on it.
Climate science is in it's infancy.Only since 1979 have satelites been measuring ice extent.So when they publish reports our ice caps have been at an all time recorded low, they are correct, but they neglect to mention they just don't know what they were in the world's hottest recorded year of 1934!
Ships logs suggest similar low extent.
So my mind is still open.But I am in the skeptics camp.Because that's where I find the evidence suggest I should be.

I think I can safely say that by polluting our air through co2

Sorry Daniel, I agree thoroughly with your concern for the environment.But CO2 is not a pollutant.Best tomato crop I've had this year.Those plants just love all that increased CO2.!
:D As I've said before , they don't ban Coca-cola do they?
In fact global temperatures around the world have risen in accord with Coca-Cola's increased consumption over the past 50 years. :D


The problem with us acting as the alarmists want us to, and rushing off with all these measures to combat climate change is this-the unforseen consequences.
Under treaty nations obligations to reach Kyoto Protocol targets on biofuel production, we rush to plant the crops to create methanol.
And saw rice quadruple in price.Massive increases in deforestation in Indonesia and Brazil .Diversion of streams to irrigate these crops, leaving downstream farmers starving because they have no water.

No one of those so called experts had the common sense to work out the simple equation of x amount of biofuel requires x amount of land,...which we haven't got!
Unless you cut down trees.Or throw people off their land .
Now had they taken a longer term view, and invested in biological manipulation of sub desert plant species,they may have been able to reach those targets by utilising other plant species.Go google Jojoba,jatropha,and madagascar kalankoe.Just 3 plants that could be cropped in desert areas where no one is thrown off their land, no trees are cut down,little if any water is needed,and desert areas are reclaimed.
Just an example of taking a more rational,slower, and planned approach to much needed long term change.

There is no doubt in any one's mind, that as Explorerwannabe says, we need to cut down on waste.And as you say, we need to stop polluting.You are both saying the same things.
We do that by making fundamental changes in our way of living.There is a report I was reading suggesting that the way forward is not cap and trade, carbon emission taxes, etc, but investing in technology.Because technology is improving exponentially.Hardly has a new technolgy been implemented, then it is outdated.
We see this with the rush to outlaw incandescants.And billions of CFL's are now being put into use....containing mercury.And every one of those is going to end up in our landfills.Some small % may be 'reclaimed'.Don't bet on that!
This is just another example of this stupid ec0-greenie zealotous rush to push a solution which brings unforseen consequences.
But there is another technology on the horizon.Which we should have just waited for.
LED lighting is almost ready for mass use .Gone will be the days of lightbulbs.Your drapes can be your controllable light source.You paint a wall , and it can light your room at the flick of a switch.
Unbelievable?What's lighting all your dashboard on that new car?
http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2009/02/ ... he-future/

Just another example of our rush when less haste could mean a better planned solution.

There's countless other examples.But behind it all I sense there is a great push to place ever more control on our lives.Ever more intrusion over or rights and activities.A great need to have ultimate power over everything we do.
I can't fathom any other reason for this scaremongering.When our children will have far more knowledge and greater technology, to solve these problems we face.
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Re: What are you doing for Earth Hour?

Postby jimshu » Fri Mar 27, 2009 10:09 pm

From Wikipedia-
Earth Hour is an international event organised by the WWF (World Wide Fund for Nature/World Wildlife Fund), and held on the last Saturday of March each year, which asks households and businesses to turn off their non-essential lights and electrical appliances for one hour to raise awareness towards the need to take action on climate change. Earth hour was conceived by WWF Australia and the Sydney Morning Herald in 2007, when 2.2 million residents of Sydney participated by turning off all non-essential lights


Here in NZ it's being promoted to raise awareness to 'combat climate change'.

I think that raising aweness is fantastic.But sitting in the dark with a candle glowing is certainly not raising awareness, purely tokenism IMO.

All I can say is get AWARE.Read some reports.Explore the web for the huge amount of research that is never published or reported on in your media.Get beyond the headlines.Don't follow the sheep.Start forming your own opinions.
Forget about lighting a candle-light your thirst for knowledge!
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Re: What are you doing for Earth Hour?

Postby thecakeisalie » Sat Mar 28, 2009 2:25 pm

Way to push the hot button, Jimshu! :wink:

As a gimmick, I don't think Earth Hour is a bad way to get people to pay attention to the topic, but followup action is where the dividends will be paid. Living by candlelight for an hour will probably not change the world, but maybe it will cause more people to rethink their usage of resources, waste practices, etc. Still, I'm not going to be horribly offended if somebody leaves there TV on to watch the NCAA tonight!

As for myself, I'm not intending to celebrate Earth Hour by any means, but I am planning to try and document it, which gives me an excuse to play with my camera. I saw on the news last night that they'll be shutting off the lights to the Wrigley building downtown (the super lit up one on the Chicago River for any that have been here) as well as a bunch of others, and I'd like to get some long exposures of the city. Unfortunately it is supposed to snow tonight, so who knows if I'll have any luck. Regardless, my lights will be off, because I won't be home! And for those concerned, I'll be walking the approx. 12 mile roundtrip...

By the way, have any of you read the book "State of Fear" by Michael Crichton? It's mostly a thriller and requires a large suspension of disbelief, but there's some concepts that you may find interesting regarding the fear of climate change, whether its real or not. Anyway, its a quick read, something to kill a long plane ride.
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Re: What are you doing for Earth Hour?

Postby jimshu » Sat Mar 28, 2009 4:13 pm

Hi Tckle. Yeah great book,and I'd reccommend it also.
Reading that really opened my mind and threw a new slant at me on all this subject.
Should be banned.Too subversive!LOL :D
I turned all my lights on to celebrate Human Achievement Hour... :D
http://www.sfexaminer.com/opinion/colum ... 77822.html
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